A new season of DC’s Legends of Tomorrow means a new season of roundtables where Fangirlish writers Alyssa, Lizzie, and Lyra discuss the hot topics from every Legends of Tomorrow episode.
In Legends of Tomorrow’s season 2 premiere, our Legends found themselves “Out of Time” as historian Nate Heywood, with the help of Arrow‘s Oliver Queen, sought to learn how our Legends became scattered in the first place.
What were your overall thoughts on “Out of Time?”
Alyssa: No one is more shocked than me when I say that I absolutely loved Legends of Tomorrow’s season premiere. And a big part of that was a tonal shift that showcased the elements that make Legends of Tomorrow a thrilling time travel show. Last season, Legends of Tomorrow took itself way too seriously. It was way too dark and didn’t capitalize on the many opportunities that time travel series present. But almost immediately in this episode there was a new tone to the show where it really embraced its quirks and a jovial quality that made it incredibly enjoyable. This is the show that I wanted last season.
Everything just really seemed to click in this episode. From the way the show kicked off – with a cameo from Stephen Amell and the introduction of Nick Zano – to our Legends doing their thing in France to the big bads that had a personal connection, this premiere set up some pretty great things for this season.
Lizzie: Color me surprised, that was ….good. Way better than most of season 1, to be honest. Fun and light and with both banter and a tiny hint of consequences (Fine, not so tiny, but it’s still leagues behind Frequency and Timeless). Having Oliver Queen make an appearance in the first episode back was the right choice, as it tied all the stories together. As for the others …Sara has always been my fave, and she remained so. Ray Palmer was his best self – without Kendra, kind, concerned about Sara and not so noble that he ends up doing dumb stuff. Rory was hilarious, as always. The new guy was – well, entertaining in a way I didn’t expect him to be. And even Rip Hunter’s self-righteousness didn’t get on my nerves, considering he was willing to put his money where his mouth was this time. Plus, the villains. THE VILLAINS. Mostly Reverse Flash, but the combo was a good one and I imagine it will get even better when we add Malcolm Merlyn to the mix. So, despite the fact that I had reservations before this season started, I’m in. Entertain me, Legends of Tomorrow.
Lyra: Out of Time wasn’t perfect but it was more solid than anything they’ve done before. They connected the DC universe more than we’ve seen before, introduced key new characters, and had an air of comradery that showed that these people are trusting each other a little more with each passing day. If they can hold onto this feeling and build on it, they’ll become true Legends. Also really enjoyed the twist of Albert Einstein being a handsy pervert. Usually when we idolize someone we forget that they’re human just like us. I hope they continue with this tradition because it’s bound to have hilarious results!
The premiere introduced one of the new members of the team, historian Nate Heywood, as he sought to help save the Legends who had been scattered throughout time. What did you think of Nate and his purpose?
Alyssa: I really like that Legends of Tomorrow introduced a historian to the fold because it makes sense. Especially now that Rip Hunter is missing, our team needs someone to help guide them through time and the customs of that period. Nate, who is destined to become Citizen Steel, right now exists as a means to reunite the Legends and help guide them on their mission to protect time. His adorable charm and quirkiness (and hotness, let’s be real) adds a nice element to a cast of characters with varying personalities. He’s going to fit right in.
Lizzie: I wasn’t too excited, but again, he was surprisingly good. A historian IS a good idea in a mission like this, even if Gideon seems to know everything. Also, the whole thing with him convincing Oliver was very well done. All in all, I like this addition and I already think that without the Hawks and Savage gone, this season is shaping up to be way better than last. I already said that, didn’t I? Well, here I am repeating.
(And, okay, can I be shallow? Let’s be shallow. He was hot, wasn’t he?)
Lyra: Nate was adorable and eager without being puppy like or overbearing. He’s the right kind of grounding LOT needs to understand the flow of time and history. He’s the brains and they’re the brawn. They can be a more effective team at stopping Damien and the Reverse Flash with someone like him around. My only concern is how traveling through time will change him and if he’ll even survive. I like the man I’m seeing right now and see great things for his time traveling future.
One of the dynamics that got a lot of focus in the premiere was Sara and Ray. What were your thoughts on their relationship and where it could go?
Alyssa: Long before Legends of Tomorrow premiered, I had my sights set on a Sara and Ray romance only because Caity Lotz and Brandon Routh had amazing chemistry. Of course we didn’t get to see much development with their relationship at all last season with Ray’s laughable relationship with Kendra and Sara’s beautiful relationship with Snart. It just never seemed meant to be. But now things have changed. Kendra and Snart are gone and Legends is finally showing a focus on Sara and Ray’s relationship.
Let’s be real, it’s far from romantic right now, but there was definitely a vibe there. I felt it. Watching Ray show concern for Sara after her sister’s death and going to back her up as she sought Damien Darhk, watching the pair argue and make-up, and watching them reunite, it had me smiling like the first time I shipped them. I see one of my favorite ships in them. Sara is Oliver Queen; Ray is Felicity Smoak. Boom. Their chemistry continues to slay, and there’s just so much potential with their relationship. Whether it’s strictly friendship or not, I just want to see more of their amazing dynamic.
Lizzie: Was it just me or was there a vibe? I mean, I felt a vibe. In fact, there was more of a vibe there than there was ALL OF SEASON ONE BETWEEN RAY AND KENDRA. Ray and Kendra had no vibe, yet they got engaged and forced me to see them give that doomed “relationship” a go. And then, of course, there was Sara and Leonard, who did have a vibe, even if it was probably one that the writers didn’t plan for, and then he died. But this …well, there’s a vibe. I’ve said the word vibe like 5 times, that’s how much I felt it. And, honestly, before the show started, I thought they might go this route, and they didn’t. Doesn’t mean they still can’t. Doesn’t mean it does not make sense for them to go this way. Ray has always been painted like the male Felicity Smoak – and in some respects, he is. Sara is basically the female Oliver Queen. So it makes some sort of twisted sense that this sort of.
Lyra: Pre LOT, the gif sets and previous work experience together made me ship these two. But as the show progressed it was all about Captain Canary and Ray spending time with Kendra. (To be honest this is the first time in months I’ve thought of Kendra and I don’t regret it all!) Now that Snart *cries* is gone and Kendra is off in the world doing God knows what, the team will have to form new bonds. Sara and Ray is one of those bonds. Their relationship is still fresh and we were robbed of them working through their anger at each other’s person by time travel…again. From here on out they’ll work on trusting each other, finding common ground, and becoming a different kind of team. Honestly the skies the limit.
One of the surprises in this episode was the big bad of the season, which actually consists of two big bads from Arrow and Flash with Damien Darhk and Reverse Flash. What do you think about this Legion of Doom?
Alyssa: There’s something about this villainous team-up that actually got me pretty excited. I don’t know if it’s because these are two big bads that we already know or if it’s the potential of these two together, but I’m excited and cautiously optimistic. The thing that plagued Legends of Tomorrow last season was how Vandal Savage was handled as the big bad. For 15 episodes the gang chased Savage all-the-well knowing that he wouldn’t be defeated until episode 16. It was predictable and actually hurt the narrative more than it helped it. So I’m cautiously optimistic as to how they will handle the Legion of Doom with Darhk and Reverse Flash.
There’s a personal element for the audience as these villains are familiar with us. But there’s also a personal element for Sara, as Darhk was the one who killed her sister. Part of me believes that one of them could be defeated by midseason, which would leave one big bad in his wake. Part of me believes it would be Damien Darhk as Katie Cassidy remains a part of this Arrowverse. But then you have to think about what Darhk’s death would mean for history as we know it. Sure, Laurel would be alive. But does that also mean that Oliver and Felicity get married as the secret of his secret son is never revealed? Is that something we really want? There’s so many questions. But that’s time travel for you.
Lizzie: I’m as excited as I was blah about Vandal Savage. Maybe because we already KNOW these characters, maybe because Reverse Flash has actual powers that make him hard to catch, or maybe because these two have already proven themselves much smarter than Mr. Immortal from last year, and it’s only episode one. Also, can you imagine these two PLUS Malcolm Merlyn? I’m salivating right now. I hate Merlyn on Arrow, I do, but I love Barrowman and I could probably enjoy Merlyn if I wasn’t think about how stupid it is that Oliver hasn’t killed him yet.
Other plus of having more than one villain? Getting rid of one doesn’t solve the problem, so our heroes don’t look quite as incompetent as they did last season.
Lyra: I think it’s a little lazy, yet brilliant, to use characters with an already established quota of evil. LOT writers don’t have to spend time introducing a new enemy and can get right into doing evil and dastardly things. Legion of Doom sounds like a great villain boy band and I can’t wait to see how a speedster changes the things. The only disadvantage is people that don’t watch Arrow or The Flash will be utterly lost. Writers will have to find a balance with connecting to other shows without going overboard and losing those who don’t watch the rest of DC TV.
In the final moments we got a glimpse of the Justice Society of America, whom we’ve heard will play a big role this season. What are you hoping to see with the JSA and the Legends this season?
Alyssa: Not going to lie, I’m pretty stoked for the Justice Society of America this season. And I wasn’t expecting them to be introduced so quickly. But with the JSA being integrated into the story, this serves as an opportunity to explore these two teams’ dynamics and purpose, which might lead to some conflict. The JSA are a well-established group who know what they’re doing. But the Legends have time on their side and might serve to warn the JSA of dangers. This could open the door to some interesting conflict. We already know that Vixen, who is a member of the JSA, will join the Legends this season. So it’ll be interesting to see how the dynamic and beliefs of these two groups drives the narrative this season.
Lizzie: Honestly, I hope they don’t overshadow the Legends. I mean, I want them there, but not ALL the time, because that just means a HUGE cast and when the cast is so big it’s hard to connect with someone and when you don’t connect then we run into the same problems LOT ran into the first season, which was that I was actively rooting for some of the heroes to fall into a dark hole and never ever come out. Right now they have a core cast of characters that I’m somewhat attached to, and that I could love, if they gave them some development. Doesn’t mean I don’t want to see this guys, but, like, can we limit their involvement? Please. I don’t want to have to pray for black holes again.
Lyra: My hope is that they teach the Legends how to be a team. Technically they are a team but they’re not perfect and have much to learn. And the easiest way to do that is with the guiding hand of people who have worked out the kinks and understand how to be a group of heroes. I’m hoping for schooling moments, crazy outfits, and fantastical powers from the JSA.
Legends of Tomorrow airs Thursdays at 8/7c on The CW. Stay tuned for another Legends of Tomorrow Roundtable next Wednesday!